[Linux-aus] Fwd: Re: Grant Application - A grant to Moe Menshed (about to start)

Tue Mar 28 00:49:11 AEDT 2017

For my two cents, it’s important to evaluate:

*         Would the grant further the constitutional aim of Linux Australia Inc and if so, how?

*         Would the grant be in line with the policies as set by Linux Australia (usually by the committee in consultation with its members)?

Obviously, Linux Australia Inc is an organisation committed to gender equality, and one aware that in the Australian context it is not difficult to argue that there are structural, cultural and other reasons why women are not as represented as men even though women in Australia are, as expected, approximately 50% of the population [1].

In the sense that the grant could, as I understand it, it would be difficult to claim that a grant to “provide a safe computing environment running open source software in the community” is against the organisation’s constitutional aims and I don’t think anyone is arguing that.

Whether granting this grant on the basis that the association maintain a “pretense [sic] of men only” fits in with the policies seems the major issue. Given the summary of the research project from Beyond Blue (source URL in quote below) – i.e. that such an organisation might “help men regain a purpose in life, enhance self-esteem”, I don’t feel this is outside of the organisation’s goal – nor is it against its stated policies.

That said, a lot of valid concerns (and other chatter) has been had over this matter and I am but one opinion amongst many esteemed friends.

DSL

[1] Statistics, statisticians and liars!

From: linux-aus [mailto:linux-aus-bounces at lists.linux.org.au] On Behalf Of Brent Wallis
Sent: Monday, 27 March 2017 4:21 AM
To: Linux Australia Mailing List <linux-aus at lists.linux.org.au>
Subject: Re: [Linux-aus] Fwd: Re: Grant Application - A grant to Moe Menshed (about to start)

https://www.beyondblue.org.au/about-us/research-projects/research-projects/men-s-sheds-in-australia

On Mon, Mar 27, 2017 at 4:21 PM, Russell Coker <russell at coker.com.au <mailto:russell at coker.com.au> > wrote:

Robert asked me to forward this message to the list as he isn't aware of how
to use lists.  I've removed the phone number, I'll provide it privately to
anyone who has a good reason to call him.

----------  Forwarded Message  ----------

Subject: Re: [Linux-aus] Grant Application - A grant to Moe Menshed (about to
start)
Date: Sunday, 26 March 2017, 8:55:43 AM AEDT
From: Robert Palmer <rpalmer47 at gmail.com <mailto:rpalmer47 at gmail.com> >
To: russell at coker.com.au <mailto:russell at coker.com.au> 

Dear Russell,
  The reason that it is called a menshed is so that wives left at home do
not worry that their husband is seeing another woman.  In Wagga Wagga
Menshed one or two women actually had official position and were an asset.
I find that a few women do improve the character of the club.  In the same
way, having a computer room and section changes the character of the club
otherwise ex-tradesmen overwhelmingly predominate.  I am not an
ex-tradesman and have an odd background for this organisation.  I started
bee-keeping in Wagga Wagga Menshed; this was not in the character of the
organisation.  It is, I think, rather important to keep the pretense of men
only but it is better if it is not the reality.
 Talk to Collin Wooton on Tel ******** to get a more valid picture of
Moe Menshed values
Yours faithfully Robert Palmer

On 25 March 2017 at 18:40, Russell Coker <russell at coker.com.au <mailto:russell at coker.com.au> > wrote:

> Robert, we are having ongoing discussions about your application for a
> menshed
> grant.  Robyn says that in Adelaide the mensheds don't exclude women.  To
> clarify the issue please briefly explain what you are doing to make your
> menshed welcoming to women and non-binary people.
>
> On Saturday, 25 March 2017 5:04:47 PM AEDT Noel Butler wrote:
> > On 25/03/2017 07:10, Paul Wayper wrote:
> > > On 24/03/17 16:36, Kathy Reid wrote:
> > >> Let's called it a BIKE-shed, because this is exactly what this is.
> > >
> > > I disagree.  I fully agree with Russell - if it's open to all people,
> call
> > > it a shed or a hackerspace or whatever.  I would not like to see Linux
> > > Australia--
> > Mens Shed is their Australia wide legal name, they are everywhere, I've
> > helped out a couple local ones myself when they needed some telco work
> > done, so your argument on what they call themselves is pointless, they
> > also aren't just a bunch of old blokes, there's teenagers as young as 16
> > involved.
> >
> > > I would not like to see Linux Australia putting money toward something
> > > where women were excluded
> > So you objected a few years back when LA gave to the womens only thingy?
> > Dont recall your name saying as much.
> >
> > All forms of gender/sex discrimination is wrong, but when you do, you
> > cant play favorites, all sides are to be treated and considered without
> > the "gender only" consideration - unless you want to appear  before the
> > federal court to explain your actions if a rejection is challenged :)
>
> https://linux.conf.au/attend/code-of-conduct/
>
> The CoC used for LA events refers to "unwarranted exclusion from
> conference or
> related events based on age, gender, sexual orientation".  So having a
> women-
> only event to address problems with the exclusion of women in many areas of
> technology is acceptable.  But having a men-only technology event would be
> unwarranted.
>
> --
> My Main Blog         http://etbe.coker.com.au/
> My Documents Blog    http://doc.coker.com.au/
>
>

--
Robert Palmer

-----------------------------------------
--
My Main Blog         http://etbe.coker.com.au/
My Documents Blog    http://doc.coker.com.au/

_______________________________________________
linux-aus mailing list
linux-aus at lists.linux.org.au <mailto:linux-aus at lists.linux.org.au> 
http://lists.linux.org.au/mailman/listinfo/linux-aus

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.linux.org.au/pipermail/linux-aus/attachments/20170327/40221bed/attachment.html>