[Linux-aus] Re: [LACTTE] Constitution Version 6 - Last one!

[Pia Smith <pia@linux.org.au>]

<sigh>

On Tue, 2004-01-06 at 03:05, Anand Kumria wrote:

> Okay, agreed but I think you can only examine the amendments you listed
> in draft 5.

OK, sorry for the disruption fols. We are voting on Ammendment 5 and 5
only. We will deal with 7 later, the only diff is a easier way to accept
members more automatically. Unless anyone can see a loop hole to get the
ammendment accepted in a constitutional happy way (David L. this is your
arena).

> > No it doesn't, if you could please read the draft, and find:
> > "As soon as practicable after receiving an application for membership,
> > the Secretary is to approve the application or must refer the
> > application to the committee which is to determine whether to approve or
> > to reject the application."
> 
> That doesn't exist in draft5 (or 6 or 7).

It exists in draft 7. Rule 3(2) and is reference in change 5, correctly
might I add.

> > Also someone being entered in the database doesn't immediately make 
> > them a member. Other stuff is required.
> 
> Actually all that is required is that the committee (or the secretary on
> behalf of the committee) accept them as a member.

Yes, but the OLD constitution says:
Point 3(4) "enter the applicant's name in the register of members and,
on the name being so entered, the applicant becomes a member of the
association."

which is obviously just silly. Putting them in the database makes them a
member? How about informing them, does that mean that if all other steps
are skipped, that putting someones name in the registry immediately
makes them a member? Literally, yes.

> Imagine if it already existed and we gave lifetime membership to, say, 
> SCO. Need I say anything more? Reviewing organisation affliations and 
> membership regularly is healthy.

Reviewing is fine, but having them as part of the monetary cycle is more
overhead. There are mechanisms to remove members and affiliations, so if
necessary the organisation can use those. Why make more work for
ourselves?

> > Anyone second this change?
> 
> We can just vote on it at the SGM I think.

We shall be voting on the AGM as a whole first. If that doesn't pass,
then we can do change by change.

 
> > > 	- Change 20; second part replaces "or by" with "and". Does that
> > > 	  mean you need to have 3 present _and_ 3 proxy members?
> > 
> > No, you misread. The "and" is in part (2) and requires that a
> > chairperson must be supported by three other members to have a poll.
> > Part of the removing too many powers from _ALL_ individuals to ensure a
> > democracy.
> 
> Actually I think you don't understand the impact that change will have.
> what if the chairperson _doesn't_ want to have a poll on the issue? In
> that case 3 members can force him/her to have one. The advantage of
> being chairperson is that you don't need 2 other people to support you
> in your need for a poll. 

Then it won't happen. It does say "and". No member can force the
chairpersons opinion.

> > > 	- Change 22; removes the ability of the membership to override
> > > 	  the committee. Why is part (2) deleted? Surely you want money
> > > 	  to be deposited as soon as possible?
> > 
> > Part (2) is not deleted, what crack are you smoking ;)
> 
> I'm reading change 22:
> 
> "In rule 35, FUNDS SOURCE, delete "general" from (1) and insert
> "committee".
> 
> Delete (2)"

Ah, obviously a typo. Pity it wasn't picked up before. We are however
voting on the changed constitution, and the summary of changes is only
for reference and convenience. So the actual changes within the
constitution are the correct ones, therefore (2) still exists. We
obviously can't make the change to the summary of changes (as we have
already said we can't change past version 5) and so it will have to
stay.

> > > 	- Change 23; is unneccessary, Common/Company seals are no longer
> > > 	  required for companies or associations in NSW (they are
> > > 	  optional).
> > 
> > Actually, if you read the NSW organisations constitution guide, it _IS_
> > still a requirement.
> 
> I can't see it anywhere, where are you looking?

...same place as you apparently.

> <URL:
> http://www.fairtrading.nsw.gov.au/business/associations/aboutincorporatedassociations.html>

http://www.legislation.nsw.gov.au/fullhtml/inforce/act+143+1984+FIRST+0+N

Schedule 1 Matters to be provided for in rules of an incorporated
association and in model rules

(Sections 11, 73)
<snip>
14   Common seal

        Provision for the custody and use of the common seal of the
        incorporated association.
<snip>

Anything else?
Pia
-- 
Pia Smith <pia@linux.org.au>
Linux Australia