[Linux-aus] Linux trade advertising - was Re: [Linux-aus] RE:women at the keyboard

Rick Marshall rjm at zenucom.com
Fri Feb 21 15:24:02 UTC 2003

we spend a fair bit of time beating each other up as well. redhat?
debian? slackware? who cares?

i build business solutions for clients using the best available tools.
so let's discuss some of those issues and understand better why we have
(hopefully) better software.

eg for me, being able to write small cooperating programs is essential
to the operatin of large distributed systems; m$ didn't invent java
(.net, asp, etc are all responses to oss initiatives); php, tcl, perl,
and their associated communities are great examples of what oss can do.
not to mention that this is real reusable code.

gnome, kde, blue curve(?), are all better user interfaces. open office
is great as are abiword etc.

after wasting a week on outlook problems one of my offsiders has thrown
it out and uses squirrel mail - and only keeps xp for user support

so it might sound arrogant, but i really don't care what bill or m$ do,
and my clients only care that i deliver the best solutions.

long winded, but i want to say i agree and can we focus on helping each
other do a better job - be known by the quality of our work (to
paraphrase a religious leader)


On Fri, 2003-02-21 at 17:59, Bret Busby wrote:
> On Fri, 21 Feb 2003, Bret Busby wrote:
> > On Fri, 21 Feb 2003, Brent Wallis wrote:
> > 
> > > 
> > > Try this, (and I apologise to any our there who do this, but someone has
> > > to say something).... Google for Linux Consultancies in Australia, then
> > > make a list of all the web sites you find that make wild and unrelated
> > > claims about MS, or even worse, that spend pages of HTML 
> > > with the "MS are the evil empire and we will be mind melded with BG if
> > > where not careful" You know, this does more harm than good.....and if
> > > you read some of them closely, it is really just "self justification"
> > > and ego getting in the way.
> > > 
> > > I truly wish some major consultancies would
> > > rethink their take in this regard.....because it affects everyone. :(
> > > 
> > > I should point out that I have a marketing and merchants career behind
> > > me as well as IT, which is why a lot of 
> > > the rhetoric piques my interest and ....on going concern.
> > > 
> > > 
> > 
> > I quite agree. Unfortunately, the way of advertising in Australia, 
> > appears to be, not "you should buy from us, because our product is good, 
> > because...", but, rather, "Don't buy from those slimy degenerates who 
> > are our competitors, because their products stink".
> > 
> > And, yes, if Linux traders want to be taken seriously, and want Linux to 
> > be taken seriously in the commercial world, a bit of maturity and 
> > honour is required; rather than putting down rivals, with derogatory 
> > comments, Linux, and, Linux traders, should be promoted on the basis of 
> > the merits of the associated products, NOT from denigrating rivals and 
> > rival products.
> > 
> > It all depends, really, on whether Linux traders want themselves, and 
> > Linux, to be taken seriously.
> > 
> > 
> Actually, in thinking about it, this is perhaps something that the Linux 
> community, including the LUG's and their mailing lists, could consider. 
> Example; Yopper, a NZ Linux distribution was released. We saw no 
> discussion of it on the PLUG list; no evaluation, no comparisons, etc. 
> But, we have a steady flow of messages "Microsoft are slimeballs 
> because...", and, "Look at what Microsoft are up to now...".
> The problem is that the Linux community appears to be predisposed to 
> denigrating Microsoft, rather than discussing Linux issues.
> It's a bit like discussing the politics of the USA-UK war against Iraq 
> on Linux lists. It MAY have an impact on Linux, but it is not really 
> related to Linux. Likewise, Microsoft MAY have an impact on Linux, but, 
> Microsoft is not Linux (as far as I am aware). Similarly, discussions 
> on whether Linux should be used by, or promoted to, the Iraqi's. As 
> Kalashnikov said; "we make the rifles - we do not use them to kill 
> people". Similarly, peripheral discussions about who should or should 
> not be using Linux; and, what Microsoft is doing (who cares what 
> coloured undertpants Bill Gates or any Microsoft employee wears?), are 
> all external to Linux isues, but, unfortunately, much of the Linux 
> community dwell too much on such issues, and, using Linux resources (eg, 
> mailing lists, and, advertising related to Linux goods and services), to 
> dwell on such issues.
> I suggest that this is why Linux has not been accepted and implemented 
> as much as it could have been.
> If Linux people show that they do not regard Linux and Linux-related 
> goods and services, as things that should be taken seriously, and that 
> they regard Linux and Linux-related goods and services as so lacking in 
> merit as to be unable to promote the merits of Linux in its own right, 
> then, of course, those attitudes will rub off on the rest of the world, 
> and, Linux will continue fighting to be taken seriously, until the Linux 
> community both takes Linux seriously, and, shows that it takes Linux 
> seriously, and, shows that both Linux and the Linux community, are 
> sufficiently mature and worthwhile, so as to not denigrate Linux by 
> denigrating others and other products, in the name of Linux.
Rick Marshall <rjm at zenucom.com>
Zenucom Pty Ltd

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