[Lugcomms] Transcript of tonight's meeting

[Donna Benjamin]

(20:01:57) KatteKrab: Ok - Hi all!
(20:02:00) cafuego: Meeting notes via Gobby on tangam.dns.alias.net:6522
- password is the channel name.
(20:02:04) KatteKrab: 1. LUG structures - casual gatherings vs formal
incorporation: pros / cons / experiences / resources.
(20:02:04) KatteKrab: 2. LCA call for papers - spreading the word wide
and far... http://linux.conf.au/cfp 
(20:02:04) KatteKrab: 3. F2F meeting of LUG organisers? Yes / No /
Maybe / When / Never
(20:02:13) cafuego: tangram.dnsalias.net 9sorry)
(20:02:20) KatteKrab: 1. LUG structures...
(20:02:57) pschulz01 [n=pschulz0 at ubuntu/member/pschulz01] entered the
room.
(20:03:10) Czaxx: ok I'll go first if no-one else is
(20:03:12) KatteKrab: there's been a bit of discussion about whether or
not LUGS should/could incorporate 
(20:03:17) Czaxx: TasLUG == icorp assoc
(20:03:18) ***pschulz01 has a quick look around.
(20:03:21) latent: humbug is slightly more than a casual club (we've
constitution) but we've never got our crap together enough to become
incorporated.
(20:03:25) KatteKrab: - or whether they can be somehow formed under the
umbrella of LA
(20:03:51) ***Czaxx thinks that is a good idea
(20:04:02) cafuego: LUV == icorp assoc
(20:04:02) KatteKrab: Czaxx: and latent - cool.
(20:04:05) donak: biggest advantage for Humbug is meeting at the
UniQ ... no insurance problems, if you have permission to be there
(20:04:20) latent: i've never been sold on any advantages
(20:04:26) latent: donak: we sure as hell do
(20:04:31) ***pschulz01 is listening.
(20:04:41) cafuego: Being incproprates means you need paperwork and
people who manage that paperwork and (important) who hand it over to the
next ctte.
(20:04:51) touchwood: I think our group works because it is a casual
meeting between like minded people.
(20:04:59) Czaxx: basically all incorporation gives you is the ability
to hold property, to gain PLI (although unincorp can do that as well)
and lays down formal rules
(20:05:04) cafuego: We apparently have #1, not so much with the #2 and
#3 ;-)
(20:05:04) donak: I was in involved in getting a small club inc'd ...
insurance was the only reason to do so
(20:05:20) donak: eventually, we didn't
(20:05:29) latent: we can barely run an agm once a year ;)
(20:05:30) Czaxx: you can get insurance if you are an unincorp assoc
(20:06:01) touchwood: We are lucky as the local SES hosts our meetings
and as long as we sign in we are covered by there insurance.
(20:06:14) Czaxx: the problem is that each of the office holders (and to
get insurance as an unincorp you need to have office holders) are
jointly and severably liable
(20:06:17) KatteKrab: I assume there are also costs involved in
incorporating / registering business names...
(20:06:36) donak: incorporation protects individuals, the insurance and
assets etc. is in the name of the association, instead of the names of
people
(20:07:06) Czaxx: donak - its a matter of risk though
(20:07:23) touchwood: There must be a size where incorporation has
benefits - as with property etc.
(20:07:37) KatteKrab: so - we already have a mix of groups that are, and
groups that aren't...
(20:07:44) donak: cost of incorp'n, annual reporting & financial
reporting to State authority (in Queensland anyway)
(20:07:44) KatteKrab: yama - you here?
(20:07:46) Czaxx: certainly property is the main thing
(20:07:54) KatteKrab: noisymime: what about you guys?
(20:07:58) Czaxx: and the ability for the incorp body to contract
(20:08:13) melissa: KatteKrab, i dont think he is. want me to buzz him?
(20:08:19) KatteKrab: hi to dtb and Jiko - don't think I know you
ppls :) welcome!
(20:08:26) donak: Roclug now numbers 6 ... I wouldn't think about trying
unless we hit at least 20
(20:08:29) KatteKrab: melissa: yeah maybe
(20:08:36) noisymime: BLUG is just casual at this stage
(20:08:43) donak: otherwise, we can just move from one persons home to
another
(20:08:48) Czaxx: donak - even then it depends on the needs of the assoc
(20:08:49) KatteKrab: *nod* 
(20:08:53) donak: err, Rocklug
(20:09:07) DavidTangye: Which LUGs are incorporated at this time?
(20:09:17) KatteKrab: ok - so - melissa and pschulz01 - what would be
involved in lugs becoming 'affiliated' with LA?
(20:09:31) KatteKrab: DavidTangye: slug, luv and taslug are
(20:09:39) Czaxx: TasLUG, although we'll probably wind up our incorp,
especially if LA provides an umbrella for LUGs
(20:09:50) dtb: hi KatteKrab - im from Gold Coast QLD - with DavidTangye
- we're lookin at incorporating
(20:09:50) donak: true Czaxx ... if it gets bigger ... otherwise, it's a
group of friends and acquaintences
(20:09:52) pschulz01: touchwood: There is also the question of what sort
of activities the group would like to do.
(20:10:12) KatteKrab: Activities: Ongoing and regular meetings.
(20:10:25) KatteKrab: Participating in Software fReedom day
(20:10:28) KatteKrab: installfests
(20:10:37) KatteKrab: possibly training / workshops / tutorials
(20:10:42) melissa: damn out of credit. sorry KatteKrab
(20:10:53) KatteKrab: melissa: no sweat :)
(20:11:03) Czaxx: none of those activities neccessitate incorp, unless
training is formal training
(20:11:34) touchwood: so I guess each group has its core people - and I
suppose that group sets the agenda regarding the direction of the group
- if it is a small group then that direction is influenced to a greater
degree.
(20:11:53) KatteKrab: what _does_ necessitate incorp Czaxx ? I would
think there's very little reason to incorp... but I'm an anarchist.
(20:12:05) cafuego: latent, bazzawill-eee, touchwood, dbaker_, Jiko:
which LUGS are you from?
(20:12:18) bazzawill-eee: linuxsa
(20:12:24) Jiko: cafuego: I'm a founding member of HUMBUG, now in Rocky
and getting involved with Rocklug
(20:12:34) latent: the not-a-lug humbug
(20:12:41) touchwood: kslug - kempsey shire linux users group
(20:13:01) Czaxx: Katterkrab - syndicalist, communitarian or
individualist?
(20:13:02) donak: bahh humbug ... it's a lug, before lugs were
invented :-)
(20:13:06) cafuego: tah
(20:13:23) DavidTangye: On the Gold Coast, there is very little interest
here in incorporating, based on the discussions held here over the past
4 weeks. Only 3 people out of an email list of 130, would definitely
proceed.
(20:13:32) donak: Czaxx, you forgot nihilist anarchist
(20:13:33) cafuego: Czaxx: syndicalist (we have t-shirts to prove it ;-)
(20:13:35) Czaxx: holding of property, limitation of liability and the
ability to enter into contracts are the big three
(20:13:36) david__ [i=david at 124-254-69-54-dial.ispone.net.au] entered
the room.
(20:13:42) david__ is now known as dgeary2
(20:13:51) Jiko: there's been so many discussions about incorp with
HUMBUG, there's just never been anything compelling enough to get
organised for it
(20:14:13) cafuego: It seems to generate work that not many are willing
to do.
(20:14:17) dbaker_ left the room (quit: Read error: 110 (Connection
timed out)).
(20:14:32) latent: she'l be right
(20:14:34) Jiko: its hard enough sometimes getting people to do other
stuff for LUGs, let alone the red tape for incorp
(20:14:38) cafuego: so if you can avoid it...
(20:15:18) touchwood: so what about an umbrella incorporation under the
Linux-aus
(20:15:24) donak: Humbug probably doesn't need it, with it's association
with the Uni of Qld ... if we can achieve the same thing here with CQ
Uni I would have no concerns about insurance and or incorp/n
(20:15:41) touchwood: same here donak
(20:15:44) DavidTangye: I attended HUMBUG a few times 5 years ago. Given
its regular uni meeting, and its very technical nature, I see no reason
to incorporate. Same on the GCoast. You need to be looking into the
business world to find a need to incorporate IMO.
(20:15:45) donak: I have to admit though, I'm not a lawyer
(20:15:46) Czaxx: if LA is able to do those three things on behalf of
LUGs (it already limits liability by its extension of PLI) then there's
very little need to take on the admin burden of incorp
(20:15:58) ***pschulz01 has to go attend to a 8month year old.
(20:16:02) latent: sometimes i think gun ownership would be useful at
humbug. but not incorperation
(20:16:11) Jiko: latent: or some soap
(20:16:11) cafuego: The only thing we can't have LA do for us atm is own
the PO box, that would have to become private.
(20:16:16) KatteKrab: Czaxx: but I thought LA's PLI wassn't for normal
'meetings' ??
(20:16:21) latent: Jiko: a soap shooting gun!
(20:16:29) donak: latent, you're not allowed to shoot the Windows users
(20:16:30) Jiko: latent: ooh, brillant!
(20:16:32) elkeee [n=melissa at 122.110.87.26] entered the room.
(20:16:47) latent: donak: actually, we are. we don't allow it at humbug
meetings
(20:17:01) ***elkeee kicks comcen
(20:17:06) donak: too hard to clean the floors huh?
(20:17:11) Jiko: latent: only allowed for the process of installing an
alternative OS though
elkbuntu elkeee 
(20:17:41) KatteKrab: hrmmm... so - pschulz01 and elkeee - what do LUGS
need to do to be affiliated and covered by LA?
(20:17:44) latent: so, la could provide it, plus a list of reasons
groups might want to go for it?
(20:17:58) elkeee: KatteKrab, to be honest, not a clue
(20:18:05) latent: otherwise, this whole topic is just retreading for
me :/
(20:18:07) donak: KatteKrab, do you know : how is LA incorporated?
(20:18:16) KatteKrab: LA is inc in NSW
(20:18:32) KatteKrab: that's the extent of what I know
(20:18:42) KatteKrab: Czaxx: has legal knowledge super powers.
(20:18:43) donak: specific "Association Incorporation" law, for clubs
etc.?
(20:18:47) elkeee: i dont actually know anything more than the state of
incorporation in terms of LA paperwork.
(20:18:56) DavidTangye: Is LA an associations? or a commercial org?
(20:19:12) Czaxx: Katterkrab: that's right, it could either, extend it
as a matter of course (which would incur a cost) or continue on an
ad-hoc basis with LUGs making a decision as to whether a particular
meeting incured a risk that was such that it needed PLI
(20:19:29) latent: http://linux.org.au/About/Organisation tells all
elkbuntu elkeee 
(20:19:56) donak: individuals as members of LA , with a special interest
in a LUG as a subcommittee of LA?
(20:20:12) Czaxx: even if LA was to extend PLI as a matter of course (ie
LUGs"affiliate" with LA) and the cost was incured by the LUG it would
still be cheaper than incorporating
(20:20:17) KatteKrab: elkeee: could you find out what's required of LUGs
to be formerly affiliated with LA and thereby have it's protection?
(20:20:46) KatteKrab: perhaps LUGs could contribute a percentage of cost
of insurance policy...
(20:20:58) Czaxx: would be cheaper than incorp costs
(20:21:21) KatteKrab: yeah - and save the ongoing hassle of formerly
tracking office bearers... etc.
(20:21:22) DavidTangye: My understanding is that individuals apply for
PLI from LA to hold events.
(20:21:28) elkeee: KatteKrab, afaik any group sponsored by LA is
eligable for PLI coverage. this can be as simple as providing hosting
elkbuntu elkeee 
(20:21:39) touchwood: that would also provide a legal platform from
which to meet/operate without the overheads
(20:21:52) KatteKrab: elkeee: I think we're going to need to have
something more defined than that.
(20:21:53) DavidTangye: Individuals ... not groups... if there IS no
formal ie incorporated group.
(20:21:59) ***pschulz01 is back.
(20:22:06) KatteKrab: some groups require PLI just to hire a room for
regular meetings...
(20:22:22) KatteKrab: so the PLI coverage for special events schemes...
may not extend
(20:22:30) PaulWay
[n=paulway at ppp59-167-40-210.lns2.cbr1.internode.on.net] entered the
room.
(20:22:33) elkeee: KatteKrab, sponsorship based PLI covers that afaik
(20:22:43) PaulWay: Great steaming plates of chutt!
(20:22:45) PaulWay: Sorry I'm late!
(20:22:46) Czaxx: DavidTangye: Exactly, an unicorp assoc is not a
formal legal enitity per se, so it is the individuals in that goup that
apply for PLI
(20:22:47) donak: how special does a "special event" have to be?
(20:22:48) touchwood: so couldn't a lug register with LA for specific
coverage
(20:22:48) DavidTangye: You all need to understand that an
unincorporated group has not legal standing.
(20:22:57) cafuego: touchwood: that's the idea
(20:23:09) DavidTangye: Czaxx: exactly
(20:23:14) KatteKrab: hey PaulWay :) welcome!
(20:23:43) PaulWay: :-/
(20:23:48) KatteKrab: Hmm - well - there's a lot to think about with
this issue...
(20:24:13) DavidTangye: That's why you incorporate .. to be recognised
as an entity... legally. Without that a group does ot really exist, and
you cannot say you represent something that does not exist.
(20:24:19) latent: number 2 already :)
(20:24:19) KatteKrab: I think we should take it back to the mailing list
- smooth out the key questions, reasons for inc'ing - and what LUGS and
LA need to do to formalise relationship.
(20:24:22) KatteKrab: other thoughts?
(20:24:23) elkeee: KatteKrab, you're free to formulate a list of
questions to forward onto the LA ctte who have clue
elkbuntu elkeee 
(20:24:37) PaulWay: DavidTangye: IOW CLUG doesn't exist.
(20:24:37) pschulz01: PaulWay: Is there gobby server available?
(20:24:44) donak: DavidTangye, what is the legal position of a
sub-committee of LA?
(20:24:45) PaulWay: Should be...
(20:24:51) KatteKrab: elkeee: :) that's what I'm encouraging everyone
else to do.
(20:24:55) DavidTangye: GCLUG is an email list, nothing more.
(20:25:05) elkeee: pschulz01, cafuego was giving details before
(20:25:06) touchwood: some lugs will never be a large enough entity to
incorporate - then what happens to their standing?
(20:25:13) david__ [i=david at 124-254-68-188-dial.ispone.net.au] entered
the room.
(20:25:36) cafuego: Meeting notes via Gobby on
tangram.dns.alias.net:6522 - password is the channel name.
(20:25:36) DavidTangye: touchwood: they have no legal standing
(20:25:37) david__ is now known as dgeary2_
(20:25:38) Czaxx: IMHO, incorporating LUGS is generally not economically
sensible - LUGs rarely own significant property or enter into contracts
- the main issue is liability.
(20:25:44) touchwood: LA, incorporated - then the rest?
(20:25:49) PaulWay: cafuego: without the #
(20:26:00) cafuego: PaulWay: naturally
(20:26:17) KatteKrab: Ok.
(20:26:21) KatteKrab: shall we move on?
(20:26:24) touchwood: I know that - bu they continue to exist
(20:27:04) DavidTangye: Czaxx: yes, but there you mentioned the 3 legal
reasons for incorporating, plus image in the marketplace (which most
techoes care 0 about, so we are not incorporating)
(20:27:51) KatteKrab: LUGS rarely provide 'professional services' so are
therfore not really operating in the 'marketplace' as such
(20:28:22) Czaxx: and the risks that LUGs incur are generally low
(20:28:46) Czaxx: for example, if someone injures themselves at a
meeting held at a hired building
(20:28:47) cafuego: provided members don't set fire to the meeting venue
(20:29:01) Czaxx: they'll sue the building owners, not LUG individuals
(20:29:10) KatteKrab: EVERYONE! can we move on?
(20:29:12) Czaxx: more chance of getting the dosh
(20:29:15) PaulWay: Are we on to 3 now?
(20:29:20) latent: KatteKrab: definitely
(20:29:33) KatteKrab: I don't see this coming to resolution - so back to
the list with questions (and answers)
(20:29:37) KatteKrab: PaulWay: 2!
(20:29:38) PaulWay: I'm all in favour of a F2F Aus-LUGs meeting.
(20:29:44) Czaxx: me too
(20:29:45) KatteKrab: Promote LCA
(20:29:47) PaulWay: KatteKrab: Woah! Sorry!
(20:29:50) KatteKrab: :)
(20:29:56) KatteKrab: Promote LCA call for papers...
(20:29:57) donak: umm, Item 2 was next, wasn't it?
(20:29:57) Czaxx: LCA is very coool :)
(20:30:03) PaulWay: KatteKrab: Already doing that, then :-)
(20:30:06) cafuego: "Behaviour unbecoming a member of XXX"
(20:30:06) KatteKrab: has everyone forwarded the CFP to their mailing
lists?
(20:30:12) PaulWay: Haven't yet put my submission for a talk in...
(20:30:13) Czaxx: submit papers, you know you want to, all your friends
are doing it
(20:30:17) KatteKrab: http://linux.conf.au/cfp
(20:30:34) cafuego: *someone* posred it to my lug list
(20:30:42) cafuego: I'll do a reminder a week before closing.
(20:30:43) PaulWay: Fairly sure it's been out on CLUG too.
(20:30:53) KatteKrab: Probably worth sending a reminder
(20:30:54) donak: "How to find the start button on your PC without
really trying" :-)
(20:31:01) KatteKrab: the original note didn't have closing date
(20:31:03) latent: well i've announced it to humbug at meetings, can't
doo much more really
(20:31:07) KatteKrab: and closing date is August 8!
(20:31:19) Czaxx: which is a week from Friday!
(20:31:24) KatteKrab: which is soon!
(20:31:29) PaulWay: No, doesn't look like it, remedying that now.
(20:31:49) KatteKrab: Encourage those who've given good talks at your
lugs to submit...
(20:32:11) KatteKrab: a direct prod is good encouragement... and if
they've already done prep for a talk... well etc etc
(20:32:33) KatteKrab: Also - tutorials and mini-confs...
(20:32:51) KatteKrab: Anyone have any LCA questions for Czaxx ?
Otherwise...
(20:33:02) latent: (i'm putting two abstracts in, one may be good for a
tutorial)
(20:33:14) donak: Tassy is lovely, but it's half of Australia away from
here
(20:33:30) latent: oh lordy lets not start that crap again
(20:33:41) latent: perth is too far away! brisbane is too hot! bugger me
(20:33:50) KatteKrab: doesn't matter where LCA is...
(20:33:56) KatteKrab: it's totally brilliant.
(20:33:58) DavidTangye: Gold Coast is just right :-)
(20:34:11) KatteKrab: and for everyone who doesn't want to go to where
it is - someone else will...
(20:34:20) PaulWay: latent: Canberra was too hot, that's why we held it
in Autumn.
(20:34:21) KatteKrab: and given we sold out 6 weeks before opening......
(20:34:26) KatteKrab: I'm not too bothered ;)
(20:34:34) PaulWay: Which was teh awesome.
(20:34:38) donak: don't mind me, I've got 6 members so far ... we're not
exactly huge
(20:34:41) KatteKrab: anyways...
(20:34:51) KatteKrab: a lug f2f
(20:34:53) Czaxx: any questions about LCA?
(20:34:58) KatteKrab: item 3 of agenda.
(20:35:00) KatteKrab: oops!
(20:35:02) cafuego: Czaxx: Is Linus coming?
(20:35:04) KatteKrab: sorry Czaxx :)
(20:35:15) Czaxx: Tassie is known for its diving
(20:35:21) Czaxx: :)
(20:35:28) ***cafuego taps the side of his nose
(20:35:33) KatteKrab: ok.
(20:35:36) KatteKrab: any other questions?
(20:35:55) KatteKrab: No..... good
(20:36:00) KatteKrab: face to face...
(20:36:07) ***Czaxx votes yep
(20:36:12) ***PaulWay braces himself for even more LCA awesomeness.
(20:36:16) DavidTangye: Is there an equivalent email list to this irc
channel?
(20:36:19) PaulWay: I'm all for a F2F.
(20:36:27) cafuego: DavidTangye: lugcomms at lists.linux.org.au
(20:36:27) KatteKrab: DavidTangye: yes... you are already subscribed :)
(20:36:37) latent: i wouldn't mind a lug miniconf
(20:36:45) DavidTangye: :-) it must be quiet on there :-)
(20:36:46) KatteKrab: latent: hmmm intersting idea
(20:36:49) Czaxx: latent: submit a proposal
(20:36:54) PaulWay: We've already filled this century's quota of posts,
though, so it'll be a bit quiet for a while...
(20:37:06) latent: Czaxx: sorry, already got too much on my plate
(20:37:25) cafuego: latent: badger someone else into submitting
(20:37:28) KatteKrab: at the very least - we should have a BOF
(20:37:33) DavidTangye: Fly me anywhere, put me up, and I'll be
there :-)
(20:37:33) PaulWay: I suggest we meet at Alice Springs, it's central...
(20:37:36) latent: KatteKrab: there we go
(20:38:05) spidie [n=spidie at 58.174.152.42] entered the room.
(20:38:10) KatteKrab: perhaps we could ask Czaxx nicely to schedule
something in the program for us?
(20:38:21) Czaxx: LCA could try and facilitate something, certainly a
BOF, but it'd be nice if we could facilitate a LUGconf concurrent with
LCA
(20:38:35) PaulWay: Here's an idea: we set a price for attending the F2F
and everyone pays that. Then that's divvied up between everyone for
travel expenses, with LA filling in the gaps.
(20:38:39) Czaxx: depends on budget
(20:38:48) PaulWay: Concurrent?
(20:38:57) Czaxx: well at LCA
(20:38:58) cafuego: and a lic "LUGS in Oceania" table at open day
(20:39:04) cafuego: nice, not lic
(20:39:15) PaulWay: Lice!?!?!
(20:39:21) spidie: <sorry I'm late - I'll just sit here and listen -
Steve Dalton from Gold Coast here>
(20:39:33) PaulWay: Hi spidie!
(20:39:39) KatteKrab: Ok - so is anyone OPPOSED to the idea of a lug
f2f ? starting with a BOF at LCA ?
(20:39:43) spidie: hi Paul.
(20:39:45) DavidTangye: Surf too good again Steve? :-)
(20:40:00) dgeary2_: what is "BOF"?
(20:40:04) spidie: No... 3 year old wouldn't go to sleep... boring
stuff.
(20:40:09) elkeee: birds of a feather
(20:40:11) spidie: BOF=Birds of a Feather
(20:40:12) PaulWay: dgeary2_: Birds Of a Feather meeting.
(20:40:16) PaulWay: Heh.
(20:40:19) spidie: it's like a barcamp like session
(20:40:32) dgeary2_: dont know barcamp either...
(20:40:33) Czaxx: and we could certainly hold it in a bar
(20:40:44) cafuego: KatteKrab: I don't oppose the idea of a LUG F2F at
LCA
(20:40:48) PaulWay: A chance for like-minded people to get together, not
necessarily over a Linux or person-led topic.
(20:40:58) dgeary2_: oh, okay
(20:41:04) PaulWay: Is there anything wrong with a F2F meeting at
another time?
(20:41:17) Czaxx: not at all
(20:41:38) ***pschulz01 points people to:
http://mawsonlakes.org/mediawiki/index.php/Linxu_Australia_LUGs
(20:41:43) cafuego: We have our AGM in a few weeks, so the ctte @
victoria will change
(20:41:50) pschulz01: (summary)
(20:41:52) KatteKrab: Ideally - I would like to see a lug f2f happen mid
year.
(20:41:53) DavidTangye: OK how about Cup DAy , near Flemington?
(20:42:01) KatteKrab: or 6 months apart from LCA
(20:42:07) dgeary2 left the room (quit: Network is unreachable).
(20:42:17) Czaxx: katterkrab: that's a good idea
(20:42:18) cafuego: DavidTangye: On my day off?
(20:42:30) Czaxx: maybe rotate it around the States
(20:42:35) DavidTangye: OK, the day b4
(20:42:35) dgeary2_ is now known as dgeary2
(20:42:51) PaulWay: KatteKrab: great idea.
(20:42:52) KatteKrab: pschulz01: nice work :)
(20:42:54) spidie: give plenty of notice so people can get some cheap
flights
(20:42:56) PaulWay: In other words, some time around... now...
(20:43:01) KatteKrab: PaulWay: yeah.
(20:43:05) PaulWay: :-/
(20:43:22) KatteKrab: but - could be something for next year...
(20:43:31) KatteKrab: start with the BOF at lca
(20:43:38) PaulWay: Czaxx: definitely rotating.
(20:43:42) PaulWay: Yeah.
(20:43:44) KatteKrab: and then plan towards a budget that we can put to
the LA council...
(20:43:45) Czaxx: Katterkrab: good idea
(20:43:49) spidie: You've also got OSDC in December for those that will
be there.
(20:43:58) spidie: They have BOFs there too.
(20:44:04) KatteKrab: I would imagine a mix of LA funds, LUG
fundraising, and people putting in their own dosh....
(20:44:12) spidie: I won't be able to make OSDC this year but will be at
LCA
(20:44:14) PaulWay: I'd love it to be something a bit more important in
the program than a BOF, in the same way that the Linux Australia meeting
is ...
(20:44:19) KatteKrab: should be a one day thing - with catering.
(20:44:26) spidie: LUG Miniconf?
(20:44:31) pschulz01: Make it a big BOF!! (almost a miniconf) with
lightening talks from each LUG.
(20:44:37) spidie: jinx
(20:44:38) Czaxx: PaulWay: I agree
(20:44:41) KatteKrab: nice.
(20:44:43) elkeee: theres already enough miniconf possibilities, heh
(20:44:43) PaulWay: pschulz01: great idea!
(20:44:51) DavidTangye: You cannot have LUG fundraising unless u r
incorporated
(20:45:00) latent: there's no way humbug would put costs into such an
event
(20:45:08) KatteKrab: ok - shall we also take brainstorming / ideas /
realities back to the list - formulate some proposals - and agree on one
for next meeting?
(20:45:13) PaulWay: pschulz01: enlightening or lightning?
(20:45:19) spidie: What about just a general IT community miniconf -
incorporating LUGs etc.
(20:45:28) KatteKrab: DavidTangye: disagree - you can do a chook raffle.
(20:45:30) donak: lightening?
(20:45:32) Czaxx: DavidTangye: no you can still put the tin around a
group to fund someone to go somewhrer :)
(20:45:35) pschulz01: spidie: Focus on LUGS.
(20:45:41) PaulWay: spidie: that's called LCA.
(20:45:48) spidie: Would include some of the kind of things they had in
the LinuxChix ones this yerr.
(20:45:57) pschulz01: You need incorporation to get a bank acount.
(20:46:07) PaulWay: DavidTangye: I don't think there's any basis for
thinking that.
(20:46:16) spidie: I was just thinking a bit wider than LUGS (not much
wider though).
(20:46:29) spidie: Just include SIGs and other like minded groups
perhaps.
(20:46:31) PaulWay: Why do you need a separate bank account?
(20:46:54) KatteKrab: Okiedokie... I'm happy
(20:46:58) KatteKrab: shall we call this done?
(20:46:58) Czaxx: pschultz01: only if you want the acct to be owned by
the icorp assoc, otherwise you can still have the name xLUG with
signatories to the acct, however its owned by those sigs
(20:47:08) pschulz01: spidie: Yeah.. that would be OK.. I'm just trying
to avoide WUGS
(20:47:14) PaulWay: spidie: I sort of agree but there is SOOOO much
going on at LCA that I want to try to make sure I only have three
conflicts for my time for the entire conference, rather than five.
(20:47:14) spidie: :)
(20:47:36) spidie: PaulWay: understood.
(20:47:54) spidie: I can't help going off on tangents.... sorry... I
want to take over the world.... hahahahaha
(20:48:00) pschulz01: Fee fee to att to the aforementioned wiki page.
(20:48:03) pschulz01: Feel
(20:48:06) pschulz01: free
(20:48:35) KatteKrab: :)
(20:48:45) KatteKrab: Ok - and I'll post transcript to the list.
(20:48:47) noisymime: Before we wrap up, general question and I know it
was reraised recently on the LA list, but has there been anything happen
with regards to CDs for SFD?
(20:48:48) KatteKrab: from 8pm
(20:48:59) KatteKrab: noisymime: good question
(20:49:07) KatteKrab: PaulWay: you asked about that today?
(20:49:14) KatteKrab: I assume you've not heard anything?
elkbuntu elkeee 
(20:49:23) KatteKrab: pschulz01: and elkeee - any news?
(20:49:37) PaulWay: KatteKrab: yes. :-/
(20:49:51) pschulz01: KatteKrab: That would be a question for SFD.
(20:49:56) elkeee: KatteKrab, the last i heard, the council was
unwilling to cover the amount and waiting for a revised proposal
(20:50:16) pschulz01: KatteKrab: Ahh.. (thanks elkeee)
(20:50:23) PaulWay: I don't want to make a big deal of this, but I'm
going to be very busy getting everything done in time if I don't get
confirmation within the next week or two.
(20:50:27) KatteKrab: I don't think that was communicated back to us?
(20:50:29) elkeee: 50000cds is potentially wasteful for cds that will be
out of date within a month of printing
(20:50:50) KatteKrab: so the council said no.
(20:50:53) elkeee: KatteKrab, it hasnt been in any of the notes that
have been posted to linux-aus@?
(20:50:57) PaulWay: elkeee: Firstly, no-one has ever (AFAIK) got back to
me and said this.
(20:51:02) KatteKrab: not that I saw?
(20:51:07) ***KatteKrab goes back to look
(20:51:35) PaulWay: Secondly, 'out of date' is relative - the software
on those CDs will work for years, and though some may contain minor bugs
and even possibly security problems it won't be "throw away" unusable.
(20:51:53) PaulWay: So I think saying they have a short life span is
actually quite incorrect.
(20:52:44) donak: Ubuntu 8.04 will be relevant even after 8.10 since
it's a LTS version
(20:53:01) PaulWay: donak: precisely why I chose it in the proposal.
(20:53:18) donak: I'm going to stick to it myself :-)
(20:53:18) PaulWay: Secondly, in my bid I specifically covered a) the
idea that LA could set a quantity or dollar amount that it would fund
and we would get whatever we could with that, and b) that we may be able
to get groups to do fund raising to return money to offset LA's initial
expense.
(20:53:30) donak: but, I did d'load 8.04.1 last night ...
(20:53:38) PaulWay: I'm fairly sure I addressed both of those in the
comments on my email on the Linux-Aus list.
(20:54:00) KatteKrab: http://wiki.linux.org.au/Ctte/MeetingNotes20080619
(20:54:07) spidie left the room ("Leaving").
(20:54:16) KatteKrab: I didn't see those posted to linux-aus list though
(20:54:21) KatteKrab: but clearly says 'declined'
(20:56:01) PaulWay: OK, well unless something went wrong with my email,
I never received an email from either pschulz01 or elkeee to that
effect.
(20:56:02) DavidTangye left the room.
(20:56:20) latent: i really have to stop looking at a computer screen
soon
(20:56:20) spidieman [n=spidie at 58.174.152.42] entered the room.
(20:56:20) PaulWay: I have to admit I did read that the meeting happened
on the Linux Aus list and didn't think to check.
(20:56:54) spidieman left the room ("Leaving").
(20:57:50) PaulWay: Sorry, not pschulz01, I didn't receive anything from
James Turnbull.
(20:58:03) pschulz01: ?
(20:58:38) pschulz01: PaulWay: I'm just reading through the mailing list
thread.
(20:58:46) ***purserj comes in really late
(20:59:21) ***purserj backreads
(20:59:23) PaulWay: The only email I have from James Turnbull that is in
any way related is where he replies to Arjen Lentz on 14/06/2008 at
8:44AM
(20:59:42) melissa: PaulWay, that's something for you to take up with
James, i think.
(20:59:42) KatteKrab: OK - 9pm.
(20:59:46) KatteKrab: Meeting closed.
(20:59:55) melissa: KatteKrab, indeed, i have another meeting to attend
now :)
(21:00:02) KatteKrab: Thanks everyone!


-- 
Donna Benjamin - Executive Director
Creative Contingencies - http://cc.com.au
ph +61 3 9326 9985 - mob +61 418 310 414
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