[Linux-aus] DKIM yet again

[Russell Coker]

For starters Noel is taking a bad approach to this.  Noel please don't do 
that.

On Monday, 31 December 2018 1:15:36 PM AEDT Russell Stuart via linux-aus 
wrote:
> Apart from that I'm not sure what the solution is, other than to say
> things tend to work themselves out over time.  A bureaucracy may be
> slow, but it has a inevitability to it that rewards those who are
> patient and persistent.  This is Russell's second year at it, and if he
> keeps it up I am sure it will be fixed.  Eventually.

From my previous message:
# https://lists.linux.org.au/pipermail/linux-aus/2017-July/023173.html
#
# Here's a link to a previous discussion of DKIM and Linux Australia lists, 
# which contains links to previous discussions dating back to 2013.

Also my recollection is that there were problems well before 2013, but 2013 
was the earliest list archive entry I could find for it in a quick search in 
mid 2017.  So we are talking well over 5 years, maybe over 6 years.

On Monday, 31 December 2018 11:51:36 AM AEDT David Bell via linux-aus wrote:
> Linux Australia has mandated reporting and administration which must be
> completed by a certain deadline. Changes to emails, whilst nice, aren't a
> requirement of the organisation at this busy administrative time (which,
> unfortunately, overlaps with a time most would prefer to spend with friends
> and family relaxing).

I'm pretty sure there have been some non-busy times since 2013.

On Monday, 31 December 2018 2:34:57 PM AEDT Steve Walsh via linux-aus wrote:
> On 31/12/18 2:29 pm, Russell Coker via linux-aus wrote:
> > Seriously, 1 line is all that's required to make this issue go away and to
> > stop having people get unsubscribed from LA lists due to DKIM failures.
> 
> I'm certainly not seeing the swathe of unsubscribes (either DKIM related
> or deleted addresses) that you are, can you give me an idea of what rate
> you're seeing them at?

I was temporarily removed from the announce list which caused me to raise the 
issue again.  I presume that others have similar issues.  Although as this has 
been an ongoing issue for so many years they may have left already.

Steve, I recall you verbally asking me not to send DKIM signed mail to the LA 
lists some years ago to prevent people being unsubscribed.

On Monday, 31 December 2018 3:09:52 PM AEDT Cameron Tudball via linux-aus 
wrote:
> I would suggest if you want it fixed, explain your problem in a way that
> allows me to build empathy.  That way, your problem becomes my problem, and
> we can both get a solution.

I have explained the problem at least once a year since at least 2013.  
Technical problems don't require "empathy", they require technical skill and a 
little time to fix.  The time spent discussing this issue has greatly exceeded 
the time taken to fix it.

On Monday, 31 December 2018 4:33:14 PM AEDT Adam Nielsen via linux-aus wrote:
> Philosophically it is a problem if we, as technical people, are
> encouraging the adoption of DKIM and other technologies to help reduce
> spam, but then we can't even get them to work on our own
> infrastructure.  Who is going to rush to implement this stuff on their
> own servers when the experts are still busy figuring out workarounds?

It's more of an anti-fraud system than an anti-spam system, although it can 
help to reduce spam.  DKIM signatures are used by organisations like Ebay for 
obvious reasons.

Many members of this list (including the Samba team and Kathy Reid) DKIM sign 
their messages.  Making it possible for Kathy to send email to LA lists that 
can be received by Samba team members should be something we obviously want.

> I have yet to see an e-mail list configured correctly that works with
> DKIM, so I am not convinced that this config change will fix the
> problem.  However linux-aus is in many ways the perfect place to try to
> get it working, so that we can use it as an example for others to
> follow.

I did it for the LUV lists years ago and have been repeatedly describing what 
LA has to do to achieve the same.

I agree that organisations like LUV and LA should be using leading features to 
help advance new technology on the Internet.

On Monday, 31 December 2018 11:40:54 PM AEDT lloy0076--- via linux-aus wrote:
> If the DKIM filter has stopped messages from triggering some people’s
> truculent, petulant and childlike behaviour, I’d vote to keep it 

The combination of list configuration and DKIM filters has been preventing 
mail from Kathy Reid from going though.

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