[Linux-aus] Linux Australia AGM Held

Sun Feb 2 23:00:02 UTC 2003

On Mon, 3 Feb 2003, Anand Kumria wrote:

> Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 01:40:36 +1100
> From: Anand Kumria <wildfire at progsoc.uts.edu.au>
> To: Bret Busby <bret at busby.net>
> Cc: Linux Australia List <linux-aus at lists.linux.org.au>
> Subject: Re: [Linux-aus] Linux Australia AGM Held
> 
> On Sun, Feb 02, 2003 at 12:09:23AM +0800, Bret Busby wrote:
> > On Sun, 2 Feb 2003, Anand Kumria wrote:
> > 
> > > 
> > > > , from the makeup of the committee, if NSW/ACT 
> > > > representation is removed, there are only two members left (of the 
> > > > seven); Victoria and WA, in terms of states/territories.
> > > > 
> > > > Perhaps, the new committee could review the constitution, in terms 
> > > > of themakeup of the committee, in terms of one representative position 
> > > > for each state/territory, so as to balance the representation.
> > > 
> > > Why? Linux Australia isn't a representative body. Most other national
> > > bodies (e.g. AUUG) seem to run fine without geographical constraints in
> > > their constitiution.
> > > 
> > 
> > Why not?
> > 
> > Whilst the feral parliament is an unrepresentative swill, at 
> > least someone, at some time, tried to ensure that all the states and 
> > territories were represented in the parliament.
> > 
> > It depends on whether you want Linux Australia to be simply Linux NSW, 
> > which it basically is, given the makeup of the committee, and given that 
> > the ACT is contained in NSW.
> > 
> > > I must say it is rather annoying that this complaint is coming from a
> > > West Australian. 50% of the attendees at Linux.Conf.Au were locals. From
> > > the attendence records I saw, only about 30% of the people at the AGM were
> > > locals.
> > > 
> > 
> > It will be most unfortunate, if Linux NSW takes suggestions as 
> > complaints, and dismisses them as it cannot cope with constructive 
> > suggestions.
> 
> Wow a constructive complaint and abuse! Have you thought about visiting
> Donald Randall and throwing water at him and then asking to him to
> consider listening to what you have to say?
> 
> I'd hope that that kind of action is beneath you, yet that is
> essentially what you've done online.
> 
> > bigoted - "obstinately and blindly attached to some creed, opinion or 
> > party, and intolerant of others"
> > - Shorter Oxford Dictionary.
> >
> > 
> > Let us hope that Linux NSW does not retain that bigotry, and, instead 
> > becomes Linux Australia, with regional representation, AND with the 
> > ability to accept and consider constructive suggestions.
> 
> I think first you should examine your behaviour and see if it would be
> appropriate in the real world. It wasn't. No one *had* to respond to
> you, you don't represent all of WA nor any substantial portion of
> Armidale.
> 
> Let's hope you are not always such an affront[1] in real life. 
> 

It was not me who, on seeing some constructive suggestions, as the 
last president of the organisation, developed and promoted the attitude, 
as some others have done on the list, that only the people who attended 
the conference, count, and screw everyone else who uses Linx, or is 
otherwise associated with Linux in the country.

> 
> [snip - some valid concerns; which I will address in a followup email]
> 
> > Perhaps, you might have taken the trouble, to have communicated a bit 
> > better, what was going on, rather than just whinging about the effects 
> > of your lack of communication.
> 
> Please keep in mind it was you whinging at the lack of representatives
> from various locations. I wasn't. 
> 

What a heap of pure crap.

If you as president of the oprganisation, took constructive suggestions 
as whinging, and thence immediately dismissed them, then it is no wonder 
that the membership before the conference, was rerp[orted to be five, 
the number of committee members, and, after the conference, only 
increased in membership, by the number of people who were made members 
by attending the conference.

I sincerely hope that the new president is capable of dragging the 
organisation from the cesspool into which you appear to have dragged 
it, and into which, others appear to be striving to keep it.

> [snip - conspiracy theory]
> 
> > > > It is not that I have anything against any of the committee members - I 
> > > > hardly know them - but to me, my suggestion makes it more 
> > > > representative of the Australian federation, and therefore, it would 
> > > > make Linux Australia a more representative body, and therefore, its 
> > > > actions would be more likely to involve the interests of the whole of 
> > > > the country.
> > > 
> > > Well, as you point out there are people from various states; but no one
> > > particular state has a majority in the committee. That should stop your
> > > immediate concern about one state or the other "taking over" the running
> > > of things.
> > 
> > NSW/ACT has control. 
> 
> Yes, NSW/WA have control. Yes, NSW/VIC have control. Yes WA/VIC/ACT have
> control. Moreover the members have control.
> 
> > Look at the numbers, since you raise the point of 
> > majorities. That was already addressed in my first email about the 
> > situation. Five out of seven, to me, is a significant majority. I 
> > believe that the usual term for such a majority (it may be two-thirds, 
> > or three quarters, depending on a specific constitution), is a Special 
> > majority, which can have special status, such as the authority to 
> > rescind previous resolutions, etc.
> 
> Check the constitution. You'll find no such thing exists aside from in
> your mind.
> 
> > 
> > > 
> > > speaking for myself,
> > > Anand
> > > 
> > > 
> > 
> > Yeah, sure.
> > 
> 
> Yes, sure. Unless you are also speaking for Anne as well as yourself.
> And what about Clear Solution, WALLETS and the Cornish Association of
> Western Australia. We can assume you are also speaking on all their
> behalf as well.

I had not dragged your personal life into this, as it was unrelated.

If that is the kind of pure malicious, offensive, disgusting policy of 
the organisation, then it will taint the curerent president, and anyone 
who is a member of the organisation.

This ranks of organised crime tactics.

I hope that the new president has not yet descended ito the pits, where 
you so clearly exist.

Thsat clearly indiactes a policy of the organisation, screw anyone and 
anything associated with anyone who dares to be so reckl;ess as to 
suggest anything different to the way that the organisation has 
operated.

You have brought shame to Linux Australia, and, to the Linux community, 
and thence, to Linus Torvalds, by your disgusting and offensive tactics.

I had not realised before this, that the organisation was so shady, so 
disgustinmg and offensive in nature, and so dekliberately harmful to 
its members and to the Linux community.

> 
> > And self-appointed "Immediate Past President, if previous information 
> 
> No, I'm not. That would be my suggestion to the current committee to
> think about next year. Which would it would be Pia; if and only if such
> a modification of the consititution was passed.
> 
> > is correct, about you being the immediate previous president, and, as 
> > an office-bearer of the organisation, which office is usually a member 
> > of the Executive of an organisation, which is of higher authority than 
> > a committee..
> 
> And the current physical address of Linux Australia. Conspiracy! Help!
> Police!
> 
> > I strongly suggest that, if the committee really wants the organisation 
> > to progress and grow, the committee needs to start communicating with 
> > people outside the committee, and, the committee needs to accept 
> > constructive suggestions, and, to show that it is willing to listen to, 
> 
> As I pointed out, if you walked up to someone and threw water in their
> face in real life, they wouldn't be inclined to listen to you.
> 
> You seem to believe the moral equivalent is OK online and moreover that
> you are entitled to be listened too. You aren't. I'll respond to some of
> the valid points you raise later -- I hope tomorrow but us conspiracists
> have to go to a lot of meetings so it could be later.
> 
> > But, then again, maybe, it just wants to stay as Linux NSW, with its 
> > head in the ashes.
> 
> Yes! That's right! How did you guess! After being in existance for three
> years with a closed membership roster and completely arbitary decision
> making process; opening up the whole thing will allow us to maintain our
> paroachicalism and ignorance!
> 

So, now, you admit the truth.

-- 
Bret Busby
Armadale
West Australia
..............

"So once you do know what the question actually is,
 you'll know what the answer means."
- Deep Thought,
  Chapter 28 of 
  "The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy:
  A Trilogy In Four Parts",
  written by Douglas Adams, 
  published by Pan Books, 1992 
....................................................